Recently started racing last year, totally new to it and would say I have picked it up pretty quickly! Between last year and this year have managed to get a few podiums... but had a couple offs in the process, broken wrist, pinky and a pretty smashed up bike! I'm still hungry for more! In fact the season started in Scotland last week and I managed a 3rd in 2 races, this seen me also get an upgrade on my license to national. If you have an itch, it needs scratched right? Well I want to now enter a road race, everyone I seem to speak to says I'm absolutely off my head! Even other biking friends who race at the circuit, family is totally against it and my girlfriend soon to be finance has even said she may have to leave me if I dont it! She says I'll end up a cabbage or in a wheelchair and she can't pick up the pieces. I understand road racing is dangerous and only having done about 6 meetings maybe I should get more experience, but I'm just itching to do it! I plan on doing the full Scottish and would like to squeeze my first road race in to, Enskillen, Skerries, Faughan 50 & the Armoy are all the races that dont clash with my other races. Just really looking for some good advice on this whole thing, what would be a good circuit to start, and am I being stupid? Few mates said I would have to spend money getting my blade to a 200mph bike to do the road racing, but I think they are just trying to talk me out of it. If anyone who does road racing can help me out and let me know how you got started! Thanks in advance
Hiya Liddell. I have done circuit racing but not roads. However, I would say, perhaps naively, that the roads are the same - but just with added hazards. You still have to practice and learn the course, and that takes time. Think back to your first circuit race. You probably had nerves and didn't really know what to expect. I imagine it's the same with the first road race. Best advice is to not aim for podiums but aim to finish. It's all about steps. The next race you aim for a better placing and so on. As for bike performance, the course will tell you what you need to know. You'd probably start with a 'basic' setup first up, and then fine tune gearing and suspension to suit. As for the girlfriend, if she would choose to leave you because you want to follow a chosen sport, well, in my view she's not worth having. Ultimatums do not make a relationship. You know the risks involved. If you want a happy girlfriend, would you be happy giving away the bikes and playing friggin' lawn bowls? Nup - problem solved. Family is a different matter. You have to try to have them accept your confidence and ability levels. In present days, there's probably more risk of being a victim of a random terrorist attack than in a professionally run motorcycle event.
Thanks for taking time to reply, I do totally agree with you, I understand the road wont be quiet as smooth and will be extra bumpy etc, but same approach to learning a new track. Your right, just aim to finish and get to learn the track, there is always next year to try and improve. I am pretty competitive and push myself a lot, but at the same time I'm smart enough to know it takes time to learn a track properly. I'm racing this weekend so going to try speak to a few guys who do it and get some tips from them, what's a good race to start off with. My goal is to race in the nw200 in the coming years and possibly the tt after that if I was good enough. I guess that's a lot of peoples dream that doesn't come a reality, but you got to dream and aim for something right? My girlfriend is really good with me to be fair, she is my sidekick and always helps me out when I'm racing, getting the warmers on etc, she's just scared with regards to the roads, likewise my family. I have made my decision, it's just a matter of whether it's this year or next.. although I'm just itching! I'll see what comes in the coming weeks...
I have been doing the roads for about 5 years now, taking some time out as starting my own business and missing it like mad. It is such a different atmosphere to the short circuits, but it is simply the best thing ever. Short circuits completely lost their appeal to me and getting to the roads was always my aim. However, it is nothing like short circuits and requires respect in a very different way to short circuit. I have lost many good friends and rivals to the roads in a way I have never done on the short circuits and seen some things that I will never forget. My personal advice is that I would do another full year on short circuits, learn more about race craft and then once you have your national licence then start to look at it. I did 2 years on short circuits before heading to the roads. I did a lot of falling off to start with on short circuits and am glad I did it there, not on the roads. I have fallen off at Oliver's Mount and was lucky. It is almost like learning to race again heading to the roads. I have seen a lot of people who have done well on short circuit head to meetings such as the Ulster GP and be terrified or had a huge moment and it freaks them out. It is also a very selfish sport, you have to ignore other people's feelings which is tough. As I say, I have seen families in pieces following incidents and it is heart breaking and does make you question it. But there is nothing like heading down the Flying Kilo at the Ulster, flat out chin on the tank, engine just off the rev limiter with another bike or 2 beside you or heading over the jumps at Oliver's Mount (especially in the wet with the bike sliding everywhere on landing). Nothing comes close to the roads, nothing. As for the bike, forget trying to get a 200mph Blade, it will cost a fortune. Either accept you have a great bike that has a great chassis but is not going to be as quick as the BMW/ZX10 or go out and get a BMW/ZX10. Personally, I started on the 600s and loved them. They are still quick (my GSXR600 went through the speed trap at the Ulster at 169.8mph, which was quicker than some 1000s) and allow you a chance to learn a circuit without having to worry about taming the power too much. However if you feel confident and know the bike, that is a great help. At the end of the day, if you have the itch, then go scratch it. Just give it time. If you don't mind me asking, how old are you? There is a reason behind this and that is things such as the TT restrict on newcomers ages and I believe it is 40, but could be mistaken. Anyway, I would personally go for it, but be prepared to enter a world that will blow your mind (and your bank balance even more so than short circuit!).
Great post @robinh73 I'm sure I watched a TV documentary about the folks that race the roads. They were/are a "unique" bunch; pretty sure I remember a husband and wife team too.
My first ever time out at a road race, torrential rain, done 10 laps in a hire car and then told to qualify after 2 sighting laps and then 3 laps to put a time in. Nervous as hell to start with but once out there, it was immense!
Giving it everything out of Mountside Hairpin at Oliver's Mount, getting ready to round the corners to the jumps, with my good friend, the late Dougie Shearer looking for a way past.
There was a good documentary a couple of years back, gave a good insight into it all. I know it sounds cliched, but it really is a large family, the road race group. I have made the most incredible friends through it, been through a lot together and had some experiences and made memories that will truly last a life time. I just wish I had started when I was much younger!
Appreciate the advice! I have my national license after completing a meet just a couple of weeks ago, I have done 2 knockhill meetings, 3 at east fortune and also done a meet at snetterton where I had a big off (high side) broke my first and pinky, it hasn't put me off, just more cautious I suppose. I'm at a meet just now up knockhill this weekend. I understand the roads aren't for some folk, even the best circuit riders, it's something I might not even like myself, but 100 percent committed to trying it. I have a 2015 blade, it's done about 4k, so I totally love my bike and have every confident in it, just spent 2800 improving the suspension to ktech with a full front fork internal kit and rear shock. Definitely have every confidence in bike, you bond with your bike, and I love it! Not even thinking about changing it, I just think a friend was trying to talk me out it. I'm just 26, no kids, just my girlfriend and my mum, dad and couple brothers, all of which are also against it, but I have already told them I'm doing something I love, I know the risks involved. I know I have to walk before I can run, I'm just pretty impatient. I know I'm not a world beater, but I do think I've learned a lot in a short space of time, most people I race with think I've been doing track days for a while, my first ever track day was just last year! There is a guy who races the tt George Spence (I dont know him) but when I was racing a couple of weeks ago, I had beaten him twice, and it made me think, if he goes the tt and I can beat him at short circuit then surely I wouldn't be that bad on a road race? A good friend who has helped me a lot and gives good advice has told me if I get through this season without falling off then he would come to help me at a road race next year.... which is fair enough, but I think my bike will be older, a lot can happen in that space of time, I want to strike when the iron is hot.. although that's why I'm trying to get advice so I also dont make a stupid decision. What's your name and where you from if you dont mind me asking?
Ok, well it sounds as though you are on track with it all and I would say go for it. My name is Robin Howells and I am from Anglesey in North Wales. I vaguely know George Spence, good rider for sure. Please don't take this the wrong way, but some people suit the roads more than short circuits and vice versa. I personally am much better on the roads than I ever was on most short circuits. The roads are a very different riding style. I can't comment on the TT, but I have done most of the other roads and it is a world apart in some respects. I am nearly 46 now, so you are a lot fitter than I am, but you do have to wrestle the bike around a lot more on the roads, which I was actually pretty good at, but some people just love a smooth surface with no bumps, off cambers, white lines, muddy patches. Stamina is another thing, trying to wrestle the bike for 8 laps of the Ulster or Southern 100 or Kilalane is very different to 8 laps of a short circuit, so while a TT rider may sometimes be slower on a short circuit, they may be a roads master. As I say, please don't take this the wrong way, I am not saying you won't adapt to the roads or be quick, just go in with your eyes wide open and don't be concerned with pace initially. As for the bike, your Blade is new enough and I would stick with it. Having confidence with your bike is everything and I have a friend who has a 2008 ZX6 and is one of the fastest 600 riders at the Ulster. So, don't think that your bike will be older. You have good suspension, get another set of wheels so you can fit intermediate tyres, which I have found great for damp conditions. Have you got a generator and awning and also a paddock trolley? These are all things you will need for the roads along with some willing and trusted friends to come along and help. Having said that, in the Irish paddock you will always find lads willing to help out and be your assistant. As for the family thing, that I can't answer. When I started racing I was single, no brothers or sisters, just mum and dad. My parents loved coming to watch the short circuit racing, but didn't want to come to the roads. I didn't discuss it with them. When mum died, I did think about stopping but decided to carry on. It is a selfish sport and sadly I have lost many good friends, Dan Kneen, James Cowton, Billy Redmayne, Jamie Hodson, Fabrice Miguet.........the list goes on, but it never put me off. So, I would say, go for it. Do your homework with circuits, travel to them to do laps before hand, don't rely on You Tube for circuit guides entirely and take lots of cash to help haggle on bits and bobs. It is (as is racing in general) expensive. The Ulster GP for a week cost me £3,000. The TT will cost about £12,000 upwards, depending on classes entered. I would forget the NW200 as the weather is shite, you get treated terribly unless you are a big name and it isn't worth it. Do Oliver's Mount, Southern 100, Ulster GP and all the Irish roads and have the time of your life!!!!! Anything else, just ask!
Hi Robin, no I totally understand where you are coming from, it's just that guys at the circuit make out as if you need to be flying with the fastest guys, but clearly the roads are totally different. I'm taking it all on board so dont worry about coming across cheeky, I know your saying how it is. I used to ride on the public roads, where I stay is rural and I really enjoyed it, had to be even more cautious with tractors and cars hogging the middle of the road, and I rely on my license for my job, so that's when I gave it up and went to track. I understand the road racing will be night and day compared to everything else, just looking forward to doing my first one. Where is it you find all the entries for the road racing events? So I presume the intermediate tyres are good for damp, but no damp enough for wets? I run supercorsas at the moment and Perilli diablo wets, what intermediate tyre would you recommend? I recently just bought an older caravan, feel like I'm staying in the Hilton compared to sleeping in my van. I've got a pop up tent, actually just purchased a decent one last night just over £400. I'll get a trolley and silent generator... they give us power in Scotland so a generator hasn't been required for me. Yeah it sounds costly, so if I entered a race you suggest me heading over to Ireland in the car before hand and do some laps of the track prior? You say a week, is that how long the event lasts, like is there a few days of practise in the week up to it? Thanks Chris
I think, sorry, I know you will love the road racing. You sound as though you are going about it in the right way. In terms of pace on short circuit, it is a good thing and hopefully you will have a similar pace if not better on the roads, but when you look at the likes of McGuiness, Michael Dunlop, Hutchinson, they aren't great on short circuit, but come to life on the roads. That isn't to say they aren't quick but they use the short circuit as track time. I would say that if you get the buzz from short circuits, then multiply that by ten and that is the buzz and excitement you get from the roads. I really can't quite describe the feeling, but when I did my first road race, it was the Southern 100 in the Isle of Man. People had said I had chosen a tough one to start with, but I thought "you have to start somewhere" . It was glorious weather when we arrived and set up, but then the weather turned and our newcomer laps were reduced to 2, which also happened to be in the rain. We then had 3 laps for qualifying, which was again in the rain. I was nervous as hell setting out, but it soon disappeared as I found I was making good pace and settling into a groove. I ended up qualifying in 15th out of 42 which I was happy with. Anyway, race days were bone dry and simply epic. It is a bumpy circuit in places, some challenging sections for sure, but there is one corner called Great Meadows, which isn't really a corner but is a flat out right hander which goes over a crest. I had never experienced anything like it before, as you clip the kerb on the right and line it up for the centre of the road over a semi blind crest. Another section, known as The Bombhole, is literally that. Flat out right hander, suspension bottoming out and then wrestle into a left, right flick. Just awesome stuff and all done flat in 4th, skimming the walls. Nothing comes close to it. As for entries, it is the same as short circuit clubs, with them all being done online. The roads are getting more and more popular so entries are getting filled up quicker. I would always send mine off the day they were released. With the Irish roads, you would also need to apply for start permission from the ACU, as they come under a different governing body and therefore the ACU insurance doesn't cover you. It is about £90 per meeting or you can apply for an annual permission which is about £300 from memory. I never really ran Pirelli tyres as I found the grip and wear rate not great. For me it was Michelin Power Cup Wets, which were awesome, Dunlops 212s for dry and then Metzeler Racetec inters. You could get away with just wets and drys, but I found sometimes that they did just give you an edge, so you could run a wet front and inter rear, or inter front and dry rear if needs be. A caravan is a huge help, just makes the time away more bearable, as with some of the bigger meets you will be away for a week or two at a time. Get a small suitcase generator such as this one which I have: https://www.justgenerators.co.uk/loncin-lc2000i-generator.html It is quiet, runs warmers no worries, has a big fuel tank and is small enough to carry to the grid or holding area at the Ulster or Southern 100. Get a decent sized trolley that will hold your generator, some basic tools, paddock stands and potentially a change of wheels if the weather is looking iffy. I got one of the folding alloy ones http://www.utilitycarts.co.uk/ which are great but pricey. They do however fold up and hold everything mentioned. Time wise, things like the Ulster and S100 are a week long event and you do need to get there early to get decent paddock space. I would normally get to the ulster on a Saturday, have Sunday and Monday free then practice would start on Tuesday. The Ulster also runs an event within an event as it were, so you have the Dundrod 150 meeting which is run on the same circuit but didn't require an International licence to enter. However, I think this has changed now and it is all just under the Ulster GP banner, so it is all one big event but you need an International licence to enter it (basically a national licence with detailed medical). The TT/Manx GP are meetings you really do need to get over several times before hand to learn the course, as it is such a lengthy circuit. The Dundrod circuit which the Ulster GP is run on is 8 miles or so, so easier to get to grips with but still very challenging. The S100 Billown Circuit in the Isle of Man is only 4 miles, but has some really tricky sections. I made friends with a guy in Ireland (who I am now great mates with) who is an Ulster GP veteran and he took me for laps in his car to get more familiar. In all these meetings, they run newcomer meetings and take you round the course with a veteran racer to get a feel for it. However, I will never forget doing laps in the Southern 100 in the hire car and then when you actually get out on the road, it looks and feels totally different. It took me a lap to realise I didn't have to worry about riding on the wrong side of the road around a blind bend! I hope that this is of some help, but again, fire away with questions and I will do my best to help!
Sorry for the delayed reply! Got caught up at the weekend and then back to the graft this week. Just listening to you speak about the road race gives me butterflys in the old stomach lol, sounds brilliant. Still not decided if I'll do it this year or next, would like to throw one in this year to see how it goes. It's just all extra money and time off work so I'm still thinking it through, dont want to rush in without making sure I have everything I need etc. When you say you can enter online, what's the website? I can have a look at the dates and see what I think would be best for me. Another question, are you aloud to start on the big bike? A friend of mine seems to think you have to start on a 600. I'm going to see about getting a generator and trolley. The tyres you mentioned d212 dunlops, am I correct in saying those are slicks? Also the international license, detailed medical, how do you go about getting that? Thanks Chris
Hi Chris, life does get in the way of stuff doesn't it! Stops racing from happening. I would if you can try and get to do an Irish round, but say Armoy maybe, which is the end of July. It is fast and bumpy. full of jumps. It is a great circuit as can been seen here: Have a look at this calendar and see what you could make it to: https://motorsport.radio/road-racing-calendar-2019/ Type into Google the meeting you fancy and this will bring up the website which will have the competitors section on it, giving an idea of entry costs etc. Cookstown would be a good starting meet, fast and flowing but still some jumps etc in to give you some nice air. It has just been though. People do start on big bikes, but I started on my GSXR600 which was superb, just a bit more forgiving than a big bike and you can get some closer fairing bashing racing in on a 600 as the grids tend to be more full. Dunlop D212GPs are treaded tyres and I found them to be awesome. A lot of road racers use them as they wear well. They can take a bit of time to get heat into but I never had an issue, just give it hell on the sighting lap to build as much heat up as possible. The International licence is applied for the same as the National licence, but you need to get your GP to do a more detailed medical than normal.
Cheers for that! It is something I am so passionate about. It is making me miss it even more though right now, but I figure that I need to give my own business venture everything I possibly can.
Me (number 32) at the Ulster GP in 2017 at Leathamstown Corner, trying to find a route through the mayhem in front of me. All were ok and I was back on the gas in a second ready for the long straight that leads on to Deer's Leap.
