i push the bars and use my feet to steer the bike. if i can't get my arse of the seat and use my body weight i feel like i can't turn the bike.
I always push the bars, never pull as it doesnt feel right, use upper body + head to steer the bike, I've tried putting more weight on the pegs to help steering but didnt really get on with it
Wellllllll now then .... far be it for me to burst anybody's bubble buuuttttt We had that guy from California Superbike School ( Cade or Cave or summat ) come to give us a talk at one of the local group meetings of the IAM Anyways ..... he has this bike with fixed handlebars so you can't turn them and invited anyone who fancied a chance to ride it and turn a corner using body weight .. hanging off the side .. putting weight on the pegs and any other way you can think of to get around a corner ...... The result was a complete and utter failure for everyone who tried . He stood back laughing at us for thinking we could do it ... In one of his books that he was trying to flog he explains why you can't and its the counter steering that makes a bike steer .. he had one of these little gyroscopes that kids play with to show us the effect of the wheels spinning on a bike . Now I know I have just opened an extra large can of worms but I'm sorry and it is not intended to cause offence so no sniping please . Lively discussion I can handle but no "what does she know shes only a tart" ... :tongue:
Fully understand what you mean Nutty, but with counter steering and using your body its far less effort, and you'd never get your knee down if you didnt hang off. lol Put it another way, try fixing a pin-ball to one side of your bike and see how it performs
Yup ... +1 on that ... shifting your body about alters the bikes center of gravity so you don't have to lean as far for any given radius of corner
The idea of hanging off the bike is to keep the bike on the fat part of the tyre (I.e keeping it as upright as possible) while at the same time having weight on the inside to turn the bike. Look at the way pedrosa and Toni Elias hang off and push the bike away from them to push the bike upright onto the middle of the tyre using their body to turn. The steering/counter steering is what makes the bike fall over onto it side going into a turn. Once the bike is on it's side you wouldn't need to steer. Try going round a corner or roundabout at high lean then use the bars to pull the bike upright and feel how unstable it makes the bike feel. Shifting your body weight makes the tyre keep more contact with the ground.
The guy at CSS was saying that your body weight does not turn the bike into any corner and that you have to turn the handlebars and thats when counter steering comes into it As for hanging of the bike its regard as giving you a measurment or guide to how far you have leaned the bike over so you keep the bike more upright as has been said before
Don't take my word for any of this but get hold of whatshisface's book ... Keith Code The art of cornering or Twist of the wrist or whatever its called
worms worms and more worms toes - tread - very large boots ......................... sorry :kiss: :bolt:
My problem is I'm a salesman's dream. I believe wholeheartedly the last thing I was told. So when I had the pro's of counter steering explained to me in great detail I thought "obvious". Then I heard the con's in great detail and thought "obvious" (anybody got any magic beans). I think it must be completely intuitive a process to you or you're in a world of pain. If you do it automatically and it works for you, great. It's another tool in the box. If you have to think about it before you do it. especially when approaching that perfect gap at a busy roundabout...Well that's like when someone throws you a right hook, you lean into it.
Once the bike is on it's side there is no need to steer wih the bars. Due to the shape of the tyre and the angle of lean once the bike is on it's side steering with the bars would turn the wheel up and down not left and right. If your at high lean and start pullin or pushing on the bars then that's when your going to fall off the tyre. You have to use weight to turn a bike. Steer to get it to fall over. Body and bike weight to turn. The weight of the bike wants it to fall over the centrifugal force of it moving wants to keep it upright. The 2 counteract each other to make the bike turn and not fall over. The amount of turn is determined by the amount of weigh on the inside (lean angle or body weight) against the amount of speed (centrifugal force)
The same guy should also be telling you that "pivot steering" / pressuring the outside peg (which is what FlatstickHRC's talking about) is part of Keith Code's teachings and books! It's not used to steer directly, but is used to make it easier to steer.
The thing is that everyone is already counter steering, but you're right that some people didn't put effort into it as they don't realise they're doing it. It's a bit like riding a bike really (see what I did there?)
