Just found the video of it running at fast idle in the garage - filmed before it went to dealer. Reluctant to post it here in public incase it could impact / influence any discussion with dealer who worked on the bike
Al just my two pence worth from my own experience here but I had an R1 4c8 on a 09 plate and I was riding it one day when suddenly there was an awful knocking from the engine that sounded very much like it had dropped the CCT. I wasn't pinning it was only cruising in 6th saving fuel at the time. Bike wasn't low on oil either. Engine had only covered 3k in it's life. Anyway after a drawn out battle with finance company trading standards got bike back to dealer. Further investigation at the dealership they discovered that two exhaust valves had bent and snapped one of the pistons in half. At the end of the day I got a new bike on a legality issue because of the finance company and it's liability. I did hear later that this sort of thing can happen if the bike has the tits revved off it in neutral. I know I never did that but I can't say what the previous owner did. My point is if it is making the similar sound you might god forbid have the same failure as my R1 did. Also I'm not saying you've revved the tits off your bike in neutral either just trying to impart that I had a sound similar to CCT fail and it was much worse. The engine went all the way back to japan as Yamaha were not happy that it failed so soon. Turns out it was part of a batch of 400 faulty engines that should've been recalled. I hope you get it sorted buddy if there is anything I can do to help or assist ill do my best mate.
Replacement engine located - it is the cheapest solution Strip down and investigation into cause of engine failure to follow - don't know at this point 100% if problem crank or top end and therefore best not to say.
I would stop right there fella!!!!!. If you suspect that something went wrong while at the dealer, then stripping it yourself may compromise your legal position. If however you don't suspect "Foul Play" and are prepared to put it down to "Hard life, high mileage" then crack on . Has the dealer given you a reason/possible cause/best guess of whats maybe gone wrong?. Has he given you a detailed description of their repair, how they achieved the results to stop the engine running at 4000rpm?. Were there any print outs before work and after work?, if not , why not?. It's only fair to let the dealer reply to any questions both verbally and in writing. Just be mindful that should you need to prove a point you may need an engineers report.
The current 'best guess' from dealer is low oil level (not no oil) and while bike on rear stand when engine run at home by me testing the idle issue there was oil shortage from the pickup which is at the rear of the sump - this caused the engine to wear and fail. I won't write in public my thoughts on this - it simply (in my eyes) does not make sense that a bike can go round Spain, do a track day, be ridden home then suddenly be ruined having been run at a steady 4,000 rpm a few times (and once to full temp to do the ECU reset) has now been destroyed. They have then said this problem existed before it went to them and when it runs at 4k the high idle speeds masks the horrific (what I think is) top end rattle it now has which is apparent at the standard idle when it is quiet - replacing the throttle body has solved the idle issue. I have said that I just don't understand how the engine which started fine and ran fine when the delivery driver loaded it is now in a condition where the head mechanic will not run it / put any revs on - yet when it went to them it appeared to all intents and purposes to run without issue - just a high idle. I did suggest shall I run it to 4k and see if the noise cannot be heard - but the mechanic said no it would kill the engine. I am totally stuck - I have no van / trailer - and there are only so many favours you can ask of a mate to move a broken bike about. Any 3rd part engineer will charge a great sum to remove the engine, strip and report , and may prove inconclusive ie. be good money spent after bad. This is how the engine was running / sounded as it went to dealer: https://vimeo.com/90420235 On that video the dealer said 'oh you can clearly hear for a split second just as it fires that the crank bearings / rattle is present - it just cannot be heard once it runs at 4,000' It now it sounds like a Ducati with the most horrific 'Death nell' rattle which is a little intermittent - but I have only run it for 5 seconds tops as it is clearly a terminal noise. Myself and the dealer remained polite and conducted a lengthy and detailed discussion today with the mechanic who worked on the bike - I just feel stuck. I can't write more as its not fair on the dealer who cannot answer / comment - the bike has epically high mileage but has had oil changes etc. (last one in September) and was faultless at Oulton 4 weeks ago.
To be fair Al, I can hear a rattle at the beginning, and a rattle when idling high..... Sorry, thats sounded flippant. i feel your pain, you must be gutted, I would be. But, I can hear a distinct knock/rattle on start up and throughout, louder then quiet. Maybe this could be before the oil gets around the running parts, cams etc??
That's a tuff one fella. I just cant understand .1. They must have started it a few times themselves to get a handle as to what's making it idle @ 4k, surely they would have heard the engine rattling? 2. Have you ran it up to 4k now its back with you? , does it sound worse?. How much oil was it low by? I don't know about other peeps bikes but my 06 when started rattles until it gets some heat into it and the oil gets around, I expect most engines would rattle a bit if started and took to 4k straight away. Did something go wrong when it was being repaired I wonder?, maybe something found its way down a inlet port when the throttle bodies were off, too much coolant or fuel down the port could cause a bent rod thus bore damage etc. The possibility's are endless. In fairness I could hear a rattle on start up but that could be due to its mileage, a bit of wear & tear and for all we know the engine may not of been started for weeks thus allowing the oil to drain down and everything inside is dryish? Check the oil pressure with a manual gauge, see how long it takes to develop pressure with a cold engine would be my first move.
They say never started as job card just said fit throttle body, but it was booked on to diagnose and fit if needed - so odd. I dare not start it let alone run it to 4,000 - and I said as much to the mechanic that how come it would idle before at 4k and happily blip to 6 - 7 k before it went to them now it's not safe to run. I don't have an oil pressure switch or know what to fit it to. Do maplins do the cameras on cables to poke down inlet tracts I wonder ? So many unexplained things with this - it simply does not add up to me but at some point you have to admit defeat and go with most painless solution
It's very hard to tell from the sound on video but does it sound like it's making a funny noise as it's switched off?
Here is how the bike sounds after it was worked on by main dealer: I did this to have a record of how it sounds before the engine is removed from the bike Any thoughts on where this is coming from and cause: https://vimeo.com/90463575 The main manual notes the following with regard to debris entering engine: Do you think its possible if that engine ran a 4 times that speed that the knocking / rattle would be masked 100% by the exhaust note as the technician and owner have told me - they are saying all the damage / condition now was present before they started to work on it.
Not dropped the oil Tim - think that will happen at dealers when engine gets swapped over - and the head removed to see if there is any damage present.
Dont know exactly without taking the head off and inspecting it - various ideas / possibilities - I find it hard that it can knock its head off at 1,250 rpm but be silent at 4k May re-film it being reved to 4k and held there a few seconds to compare to how it sounded before it went - proof or elimination type fact finding
If the oil isn't being picked up surely a light would flag fairly quickly. The more I think about this the less I buy it. I think you need to be there to see exactly how much oil comes out when they empty it.
Once you get the new engine shanked in, keep the old one and see if you can salvage it, might be work rebuilding it, even if its new heads, keep looking on EBay till something comes up.
