ABS does work trust me and it works amazingly on the BMW and Ducati, its just Honda who have added further complication introducing an "electronic" combined system, key word being the electronic element!
As I've posted elsewhere I've had this problem to. My Bike has been faultless since it's had a Full bleed at the dealers and Braided lines fitted. The Chief mechanic there has it spot I think in his appraisal on the problem. The reason why some C-ABS Bikes are fine and some aren't is purely down to human error in OEM assembly in Japan. The C-ABS bleeding can't be done by a machine so Honda assembly Techs have to perform this procedure by hand. Some Techs are better/more diligent than others, simple as. Bikes that have shown problems have thus had a small amount of air in their systems from the factory and the combination of heat and pulsed braking causes this air to fool a modulator into opening a combination of valves that should never open together. This causes the 'Back to the Bar' occurence and a quick release of the lever and an even swifter reapplication of the brakes brings back order to the modulator. Despite dealers having replaced some front modulators my Honda Mechanic and myself are convinced that the comprehensive bleed is what has solved the problem for these customers not a new modulator. I didn't need the braided HEL lines for the brakes to work as they should, I just wanted them, and they have, as a bonus firmed the whole setup up a tadge more than OEM lines so I'm a happy bunny!
We did a full bleed as per Honda's request this only temporarily fixed the fault wasn't until the modulator was replaced has it permanently done the job, in this case anyway so stating a bleed will resolve the issue in this instance isn't correct.
Well from the responses above, the one thing I can agree with is that releasing and reapplying the brake lever, does giving braking control back. The issue here is simple, this should never, ever be able to happen, so IMO there is a flaw in the setup somewhere, unfortunately we cannot prove what the manufacturer knows, but I would be astounded if they have not reproduced this scenario yet. Surely even if 1 bike suffers this, it is a safety issue, unexpected loss of braking cannot be acceptable, the fact that multiple bikes have displayed this condition, just stating that Honda cannot fault one persons bike they have tested is unacceptable as well. It would be nice to think that having tested Jimglasgows bike, Honda would have the confidence to issue a statement saying that there is no possibility of the ABS system ever displaying the symptoms that riders worldwide have reported, and that its all been a big wind up on a global scale by a diverse group of people that in the main have never met each other. If they remain tight lipped after this, it will just fuel the fire that they are hiding something.
The issue that Sinewave and many other C-ABS owners have had, I have had. I carried out the full bleed as per Honda's C-ABS manual (download able on-line) twice and the fault came back after a short period. It shows its ugly head after you had been filtering (brakes partially on-off-on-off), in town riding (stop-start-stop-start), braking from high speed or if it the temperature is high. But what I would say is the on-line manual misses out bleeding the front power unit in the pictures but it is mentioned in the small written description. After carrying out another full bleed including the front power unit (and installing heat insulation tape), the fault to date has never returned! I have ridden the bike hard, in high temperatures, lots of filtering and it's been faultless. What Sinewave says about air being in the system rings true. What I believe was happening on mine and maybe others, is the trapped air is expanding within the front power unit when it gets hot and is causing irregular pressure readings within the system, thus confusing it and the fault appears (system throws a wobbler). The front power unit is located just between the exhaust downpipes and the engine with just a thin metal shield covering it (very high temp area). I believe the shield is there more to protect the power unit from flying debris thrown up by the front wheel then to stop heat transfer/soak, otherwise it would have heat insulation tape installed on it already! As I have already said, I fitted heat reflective tape to the front power unit shield and around the power unit it's self to stop/reduce the possibility of it happening again. When I spoke and emailed Honda when I had started to experiencing the fault, I found them to be almost dismissive of my concerns which I raised about my c-abs system’s faults. My bike had covered no more then 4,000 miles in 3 years when the fault first appeared. I now have over 6,000m on the clock and couldn’t be happier with how the c-abs performs since I did the brakes with NO HELP FROM HONDA WHATSOEVER!!!!!!!!! Would I have another Honda c-abs equipped bike???????? Yes it’s been fault less since I did the work on it. Would I buy another bike from Honda?????? That’s a harder question to answer, their dismissive attitude to the fault, to mine and others concerns has left a bitter taste!
Honda are just so bloody minded and think everything they do is the best and right way. You should see some of next years franchise standards dealers have to meet. I wouldn't be surprised to see a few more dealers quitting next year because of it. When I was dealing with them over this fault it was like trying to get blood from a stone but after following their requests to the letter and still having the fault occur only then would they agree to cover the cost of the replacement control unit so I can understand the frustration from yours the customer point of view especially when your dealer isn't willing to take ownership of the problem and peruse it with Honda. Other than the costs to Honda to look into and resolve this problem I just don't understand their reluctance to do so. We've had all sorts of other recalls on many different models from plug caps and clutches to oil cooler pipes and stators, why should this be any different especially with the safety aspect I just don't know add to this their refusal to acknowledge the problem even exists with some of you, very disappointing. Which brings me back to my opening sentence, bloody minded ! This is where I see a stark difference between Honda and Yamaha, within reason Yamaha's warranty department is very good and rarely question a claim.
Excellent opions expressed above from the side of a customer and an insider in the industry. If ever you need evidence that Honda are losing the plot and are completely out of touch with their customer base, then look no further than the new Honda Maidstone dealership, a soulless metal and glass warehouse, it may fit a corporate image but is it really what their customer base wants, I can walk into any BMW or Audi dealership if I want that experience, I certainly don't need that from a mainstream mass producer of Jap motorbikes. The reality of this issue is that we are talking of a minuscule number of units in Honda global output, and they have 2 options, accept that some machines are faulty and work to satisfy the customer and solve the issues and enhance their reputation, or drive customers away with brutally poor customer service. Option 2 appears to be their preferred route, and after 30 years of Honda ownership, I cannot see any reason to fill their coffers anymore.
I to have had no ABS issues at all, my concerns over Hondas customer service are not related but do reflect on their disregard for the individual.
Thats why I'm getting out..... there are no bad bikes out there its just what floats your boat, so I have a few other options, so will post ma bike for sale, which Im sure will eventually go to a good home.
Honda's Motorcycle division has been for the past couple of years trying to adopt their best practices and procedures from the car side of the business, to Honda your the same customer. Your not seen as a 'biker' they view you in the same way as someone buying a Civic or doing their weekly food shop. They are trying to distance themselves from the 'biker' lifestyle, moving away from the warm friendly local bike shop to the cold business park corporate showroom which is a shame. I've worked in the car industry as well (BMW) so can easily recognise what's going on, I've been on the training courses and try to argue it but they won't listen. They are so wrapped up in franchise standards, spreasheets, graphs, data collection, procedures, red tape that they have forgotten about the customer, the 'biker' add to this the drab bikes they have released over the past few years and it's to me such a shame especially when you see what and where they have been in the past, RC51 RC30 NR NSR CBR etc etc etc I'm a fan of Honda and love my Blade so find it all so very disappointing. Honda will say they are doing all of the above for the customer, they're not they're doing it for themselves. Look what Yam have done with the MT-09, if Honda don't do something different and exciting instead of relying on bland and boring NC700's with amazing MPG, ooh exciting and VFR1200X adventure bikes that weigh a ton or cheaply built 500's that need valves checking on every service then it pains me to say it but they have missed the mark and their competition is winning. 2014 Blade what's it going to be another f**cking paint scheme with maybe a slightly different fairing, aaarrrrghhhh FFS ! Come on Honda, buy a ZX10 an S1000 ride the bloody things take them to pieces and make something if not better equally as good would be a great start before it's too late and the old man civic image sticks for good because you've been so wrapped up in trying to tell us what we want instead of listening to what we would actually like.
Its allways a bitter pill when someone you trusted and admired sticks you in the ribs! Come on Honda were Humans not numbers. give respect get respect!
Therein lies the problem, there may well have been since the system has been introduced, but bikes being what they are, the aftermath of a fatal RTA there will be absolutely no proof that the rider grabbed the lever and found it went to the bar and had no time to react, so the accident investigators will attribute the death as accidental determining that the rider failed to take sufficient evasive action or brake in time, especially if it's high speed and a Fireblade, all the cliches of speeding motorcyclist will be wheeled out in the press and reports. It may sound callous but Honda may well have thought of this and by denial thus keep sales across the Honda range flowing. You only have to look at what kind of damage to a reputation can be done as recently shown in the US with the Toyota brake pedal issue, it nearly ruined them in America...imagine that happening to Honda with the sales they do over there..
Sytner Leicester i bet? Rather than Sytner Nottingham! I've had 3 BMWs from Nottingham and they are shocking, perhaps because I look young but whether it is sales or after service, they ignore me and talk to me like shit. Alas I'm restricted on which garages I can use :-( Honda ignoring this issue is shocking though. The record of the issue across the internet 100% influenced my decision not to buy an ABS. You'd think it would be affecting sales, but then you read in places that 95% of German blade sales are ABS.
I have only ever been on two honda's with the ABS units fitted and both times I had the lever to the bar in less than 20 mins of me getting on the bikes! These bikes normally have other riders and they have never had any issues in there use but herein lies the issue why can I recreate the issue multiple times and yet other riders never even notice any issue at all. The fact Honda say they can't find any problems and this inherent functionality that can allow the lever to come to the bar in any circumstance to me is just ludicrice! The problem I forsee with regards to any accident which involves any of these ABS equipped bikes, how does a rider prove the lever went to the bar when the next time the lever is pulled into the bar it works as it should and maintains resistance and holds firm? The thing is a rider pulls on the brake lever expecting the brakes to work and imediatly start to slow them down as soon as the lever starts to get pulled in, when this doesn't happen someone can get into a lot of trouble and can cover a lot of ground by the time they can open there hand to release the lever and pull it in again!
Interesting thread, I must be the minority as in 2 1/2 years of owning a ABS blade I have never had a single issue with it. And I have used it in all weather. Touring, Fast road and 4-5 Trackdays so far without the issue others mention. I have only dealt with Honda (Thunderroad Newport) for buying the blade. All my servicing has been done at my local independent bike shop. JHS racing. So I can't comment on knowing how Honda Deal with people when they see they on a more regular bases
I purchased a C-ABS blade and traded it in for a non ABS within 6 weeks. Lever to the bar at least twice. I had no confidence my brakes would work when applied at all. No issues at all with the non ABS.
